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Thread: Ibogaine Therapy for Drug Addiction

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    Default Ibogaine Therapy for Drug Addiction

    Several scientific groups are collecting observational data for the first prospective ibogaine outcome studies in order to contribute to the growing scientific literature about ibogaine as a treatment for drug addiction. Ibogaine is a psychoactive alkaloid naturally occurring in the West African shrub iboga. While ibogaine is a mild stimulant in small doses, in larger doses it induces a profound psychedelic state. Historically, it has been used in healing ceremonies and initiations by members of the Bwiti religion in various parts of West Africa. People with problem substance use have found that larger doses of ibogaine can significantly reduce withdrawal from opiates and temporarily eliminate substance-related cravings. Although first-hand accounts indicate that ibogaine is unlikely to be popular as a recreational drug, ibogaine remains classified as a Schedule I drug in the United States (it is also scheduled in Belgium and Switzerland). Yet despite its classification as a drug with a “high potential for abuse” and “no currently accepted medical use,” people who struggle with substance abuse continue to seek out international clinics or underground providers to receive ibogaine treatment. By some estimates, ibogaine use has a mortality rate of about 1 in 300. Deaths from ibogaine have been attributed to bradycardia (slowing of the heart), lethal combinations with other substances, liver problems, and other conditions. Anyone interested in using ibogaine to treat substance abuse should carefully weigh the risks and benefits of treatment, and should ensure that medical assistance is available during the session.

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    if you have any opiates in your system, the process will kill you...
    you should also have your heart checked out aswell.

    Some countries have set up some really good detox centres..

    great idea IMHO but not the magic powder an opiate fiend dreams of.

    crack open your head!

  3. #3
    ibogaine seems waaaaay too scary and painful to me lol


    immodium, clonidine, gabapentin and valium sounds a lot better to me truthfully. if you do ibogaine i'm guessing you still have to deal with the post acute withdrawal symptoms as well so it's by no means a 'magical cure.' the PAWS from very long opiate use suck a lot more than the actual detox.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by phatboy View Post
    ibogaine seems waaaaay too scary and painful to me lol


    immodium, clonidine, gabapentin and valium sounds a lot better to me truthfully. if you do ibogaine i'm guessing you still have to deal with the post acute withdrawal symptoms as well so it's by no means a 'magical cure.' the PAWS from very long opiate use suck a lot more than the actual detox.....
    My buddy went to Mexico to have the treatment, after it was over he had one day where he felt weak/tired, but after that no withdrawal symptoms at all, and it has completely changed his life for the better. Says he feels like he did before he ever touched a single drug. He did Iv heroin for 6 1/2 years, Methadone for 4 years, and suboxone for around 3 years before his Ibogaine treatment. Cost him 5k, said it was the best 5 grand he has ever or will ever spend in his life, because it gave him his life back.
    Last edited by TomRock; 07-31-2014 at 01:08 PM.
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  5. My friend in wa. went to mexico. Did the treatment for Imogaine. In was and is a huge success. After seven years on methadone, he's been completely clean. Its been two years now. It might have been really horrible, he doesn't remember. I don't know i this will help anyone, but I thought I would mention it. Just my two cents worthlessness. Lol!
    Helpful Ringmaster Rated helpful

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    Bump
    A former colleague of mine is a neurologist whose primary research focus is psychedelics and treating addiction. Despite some strict drug laws in Germany, Ibogaine remains basically unregulated for research purposes. Anyway, his team has concluded from multiple observational studies that lower dosing of Ibogaine (lower than one might find in a dedicated clinic) is as effective, safe(r), less stressful on the heart, and leads to almost immediate and manageable recovery from even the most wicked drug addictions.
    I called him this evening to wish him a happy birthday, and he shared he’s securing funding for a clinical human trial to test this low dose treatment approach against the cardiovascular and other risks. He also mentioned that roughly 85% of the patients he’s treated maintained long term (7 or more year) abstinence after either a single treatment or series of two treatments over a 12-month course. This applies to patients addicted to opiates, meth, cocaine, alcohol, ... even food. Initial and follow up imaging supported his conclusion that the success of Ibogaine comes from a change in how an addict’s brain reacts to dopamine flood, and causes the person to change the way s/he views drugs and their anticipated effects.

    In the US, Ibogaine is Schedule I, and therefore nearly impossible to study with proper method. Does this have anything to do with the Billions pharma companies, treatment centers, and providers make off the addiction industry? Or is the larger piece actually the (RELATIVELY) minor risks involved?

    Anyway, I just thought this was interesting and wanted to share. (BTW, when asked, my colleague requested I not reveal his identity in discussions of this subject).
    Helpful jaders Rated helpful

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ringmaster View Post
    Bump
    A former colleague of mine is a neurologist whose primary research focus is psychedelics and treating addiction. Despite some strict drug laws in Germany, Ibogaine remains basically unregulated for research purposes. Anyway, his team has concluded from multiple observational studies that lower dosing of Ibogaine (lower than one might find in a dedicated clinic) is as effective, safe(r), less stressful on the heart, and leads to almost immediate and manageable recovery from even the most wicked drug addictions.
    I called him this evening to wish him a happy birthday, and he shared he’s securing funding for a clinical human trial to test this low dose treatment approach against the cardiovascular and other risks. He also mentioned that roughly 85% of the patients he’s treated maintained long term (7 or more year) abstinence after either a single treatment or series of two treatments over a 12-month course. This applies to patients addicted to opiates, meth, cocaine, alcohol, ... even food. Initial and follow up imaging supported his conclusion that the success of Ibogaine comes from a change in how an addict’s brain reacts to dopamine flood, and causes the person to change the way s/he views drugs and their anticipated effects.

    In the US, Ibogaine is Schedule I, and therefore nearly impossible to study with proper method. Does this have anything to do with the Billions pharma companies, treatment centers, and providers make off the addiction industry? Or is the larger piece actually the (RELATIVELY) minor risks involved?

    Anyway, I just thought this was interesting and wanted to share. (BTW, when asked, my colleague requested I not reveal his identity in discussions of this subject).
    I have experience with ibogaine. It did affect my heart, and it wasn't the magic bullet that it seems to be for some, but it's most definitely worth studying, and it's SO ridiculous that this substance, along with many of the other psychedelics have been set aside as useless. You're probably aware of Michael Pollan's new book about LSD and others, that are FINALLY starting to studied for depression and other mental issues. Maybe we will see some wisdom come back in our attitude about these substances. I agree wholeheartedly with you that big pharma has virtually no incentive to study drugs such as these, but at least the scientific community is showing interest.

    I've thought of trying the low dose route with ibogaine, as I've heard good things about it too, but I have some heart arrhythmias and it still causes a lot of anxiety if I think about ingesting it again. I would certainly encourage anyone thinking about it, to pursue it further if it "calls" to you. In spite of the bad, ibogaine had a very positive effect on my life in many ways and I certainly don't regret taking it...
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaders View Post
    I have experience with ibogaine. It did affect my heart, and it wasn't the magic bullet that it seems to be for some, but it's most definitely worth studying, and it's SO ridiculous that this substance, along with many of the other psychedelics have been set aside as useless. You're probably aware of Michael Pollan's new book about LSD and others, that are FINALLY starting to studied for depression and other mental issues. Maybe we will see some wisdom come back in our attitude about these substances. I agree wholeheartedly with you that big pharma has virtually no incentive to study drugs such as these, but at least the scientific community is showing interest.
    I’ve always held psychedelics in high regard, as a group of powerful tools that can be downright life changing. My fascination grew from a single and mild mushroom trip when I was 19. It changed the way I perceive reality and my place in (or out of) it.

    Pollan is great! I bought How to Change Your Mind about a month ago, read a couple hundred pages the first day, but I since haven’t had the time to finish it.

    I think it’s promising that there seems to be a resurgence of integrity in the scientific community. Despite the huge amounts spent lobbying against studies, pathways, approaches that counter big pharma agenda, there are still those willing to investigate something that shows potential benefit.
    I respect and appreciate your outlook, @jaders, despite not having the best experience.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ringmaster View Post
    I’ve always held psychedelics in high regard, as a group of powerful tools that can be downright life changing. My fascination grew from a single and mild mushroom trip when I was 19. It changed the way I perceive reality and my place in (or out of) it.

    Pollan is great! I bought How to Change Your Mind about a month ago, read a couple hundred pages the first day, but I since haven’t had the time to finish it.

    I think it’s promising that there seems to be a resurgence of integrity in the scientific community. Despite the huge amounts spent lobbying against studies, pathways, approaches that counter big pharma agenda, there are still those willing to investigate something that shows potential benefit.
    I respect and appreciate your outlook, @jaders, despite not having the best experience.
    Thanks @Ringmaster. I read somewhere that the more you take ibogaine the more sensitive you can get to it and it was the third time that seemed to hold the negatives for me. It still is an excellent tool for addictions as are some of the other psychedelics. The crazy thing about ibogaine is how it washes opiates (along with the wd’s) out of your system. It’s like it was made just for that...

    One of the most encouraging pieces in pollan’s book is his mentioning that John Hopkins was having no trouble getting federal funding to further study both LSD and MDMA, (if I recall the second drug correctly.).

    I mostly listen to audiobooks these days and our library has it with Pollan actually doing the reading. Might make it more interesting for you? Also there’re some great interviews with him on YouTube about the book.

    I believe that we may be so inundated with addiction in our society these days that maybe that will cause an opening in research that’s finally “outside” the box,” as clearly we have zero answers at this time, imho...

    (Sounds like you have an interesting job there...)
    Last edited by jaders; 09-27-2018 at 04:43 AM.
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Ringmaster View Post
    I’ve always held psychedelics in high regard, as a group of powerful tools that can be downright life changing. My fascination grew from a single and mild mushroom trip when I was 19. It changed the way I perceive reality and my place in (or out of) it.

    Pollan is great! I bought How to Change Your Mind about a month ago, read a couple hundred pages the first day, but I since haven’t had the time to finish it.

    I think it’s promising that there seems to be a resurgence of integrity in the scientific community. Despite the huge amounts spent lobbying against studies, pathways, approaches that counter big pharma agenda, there are still those willing to investigate something that shows potential benefit.
    I respect and appreciate your outlook, @jaders, despite not having the best experience.
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  11. @bupeybob please don't be offended by my lack of tact. That is not correct, that was largely thought to be the case up until a few years ago. I read an interview with the owner of an Ibogaine clinic not long ago. They were asked about deaths when people were at their clinic. The owner reported that they used to think that you needed to be in full blown withdrawal like with subixone. They had a total of 4 deaths, but not one since they changed their protocall relatively recently (no idea what relatively means here). Now they titrate both simultaneously. I guess I shouldn't say you are absolutely not correct, but it seemed very reliable to me. Incidentally, in my vast experience with all types of members of various subcultures especially psychedelic, I have only know 1 person who had Ibogaine so I assume it is hard to source in the U.S. but have been out of that world for quit awhile so I could be wrong.
    I have read from I want to say Harvard medical (great source for objective info on this type of thing) that scrooms are not as effective, but are effective. I have read that Ibogaine is often unpleasant and kinda scary

  12. #12
    There is no question that hallucinations can be life changing. They cause you to "question reality". Of course no one or thing sees reality, we sometimes see a sliver of reality. Deepk Chopra said he only did it about 3 times and it thought him much. Steve Jobs said it was one of the most import things he ever did in his life. It has changed my reality as well and I haven't touched it in 20 years
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radley1 View Post
    There is no question that hallucinations can be life changing. They cause you to "question reality". Of course no one or thing sees reality, we sometimes see a sliver of reality. Deepk Chopra said he only did it about 3 times and it thought him much. Steve Jobs said it was one of the most import things he ever did in his life. It has changed my reality as well and I haven't touched it in 20 years
    Having experienced ibogaine three times, I continue to be amazed that more isn’t being done with this medicine, given the heroin crisis. There’s just no doubt it mitigates opiate withdrawal greatly. Deaths associated with it are certainly no higher than with other medicines and it has as likely, if not more likely, a chance to help someone get and stay clean as any other treatment they’re offering, that is for sure.

    Something about Ibogaine seems to release a lot of a person’s “repressed” material. At least I experienced that. I felt much more “open” than I did previously. But I believe the reason it helps interrupt addictions is because it has a sort of long lasting (3 month?) benefit of flooding your brain with serotonin that is released over a period of time so that you feel pretty happy with everyone and everything. They call it a “window of opportunity” so you can change your lifestyle while not fighting huge cravings. In fact it tends to make ANYTHING that’s a negative on your health much less appealing. Caffeine, smoking, eating unhealthy, etc. Of course this serotonin effect wears off eventually and hopefully by then you’ve plugged into some new habits.

    I highly recommend at least investigating it for anyone who might be interested.
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  14. Quote Originally Posted by bupeybob View Post
    if you have any opiates in your system, the process will kill you...
    you should also have your heart checked out aswell.

    Some countries have set up some really good detox centres..

    great idea IMHO but not the magic powder an opiate fiend dreams of.

    crack open your head!
    This is old thinking. Quality clinics no longer wait for withdrawals before Ibogaine. I heard an interview with one that said they had 4 deaths over the years. Since they started with small doses before withdrawal began they have had no deaths

  15. #15
    They actually used Ibogaine on an important character in the series Homeland. They purposely didn’t mention the name, but it was obvious from the discussion of risks involved. Basically, they had an urgent reason to pull someone out of a complete Heroine addiction, that they put the person in, on purpose. Whether he deserved it, or not, is up for debate, but basically it would have completely cured him of any addiction in a very short time, or it would have killed him. If this interests anyone, the show is actually pretty amazing, and is on Showtime.
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    Is this similar to the Ayahuasca experience?

    thx
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  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Seychelle View Post
    Is this similar to the Ayahuasca experience?

    thx
    Yes and no, using the indigenous South American method does result in hallucinations, and potentially severe nausea, but Ibo is a much nastier experience, and can be fatal, but it does work.
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