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Thread: Fent*nyl flood.

  1. Default Fent*nyl flood.

    "The amount of Fentanyl flooding into our country is to me a bigger danger than almost anything else that we have experienced in recent history. You can no longer trust any pharmaceutical pills or street drugs because of how easily it is now to buy a small pill pressing machine and also purchase the pre-made pill press dies that make the pills look like the real deal when they really are just improperly dosed amounts of Fentanyl made to look like Hydr0 or 0xy.
    The potency difference between 0xy and Fentanyl is so profound I cannot imagine how the average drug smuggler could possibly reliably dose this medication and not kill many people

    Keep in mind that this confiscation of pills and powdered Fentanyl was coming from Mexico through a border entry point headed to the US market. This is not an immigration problem. It is a drug problem. I do not want to see any of our members die because of this issue. Trust no sources and be alert. Even sources can be fooled into thinking that what they offer are legitimate pharmaceutical medications." (CNN)

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  3. #2
    Good post. This scares me to death also.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bwaterson19 View Post
    "The amount of Fentanyl flooding into our country is to me a bigger danger than almost anything else that we have experienced in recent history. You can no longer trust any pharmaceutical pills or street drugs because of how easily it is now to buy a small pill pressing machine and also purchase the pre-made pill press dies that make the pills look like the real deal when they really are just improperly dosed amounts of Fentanyl made to look like Hydr0 or 0xy.
    The potency difference between 0xy and Fentanyl is so profound I cannot imagine how the average drug smuggler could possibly reliably dose this medication and not kill many people

    Keep in mind that this confiscation of pills and powdered Fentanyl was coming from Mexico through a border entry point headed to the US market. This is not an immigration problem. It is a drug problem. I do not want to see any of our members die because of this issue. Trust no sources and be alert. Even sources can be fooled into thinking that what they offer are legitimate pharmaceutical medications." (CNN)

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    @bwaterson19, are you quoting a CNN story? Who was the speaker? (I think they're correct, unfortunately, doesn't really matter who they are--I'm just curious).
    Like a Bolt from the Blue!

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    Fentanyl is cheap and easy to make, and easy to "mask." It will NOT go away, unless the demand for it goes away. How likely is that to happen? How long has our government (and really the whole world) fought against the availability of heroin? It seems MORE popular, and available instead of less, at least to me. I know I am a broken record, but this problem of "prohibition" just doesn't ever get the job done. I really really hope that a newer and younger generation, who I believe has a different view of drug use/substance abuse, will come up with a different approach.

    I completely agree with you that fentanyl is a very deadly drug and will likely kill a lot of folks. But, it just isn't going to go away. Unless most folks who want them, can actually easily obtain the pain meds they choose, these far deadlier drugs will continue to make their way to our citizens. Heck, all I ever want or need is a low dose of a low level opiate pk. When there have been extraordinarily difficult times in obtaining this, I confess I have thought about trying to find a reliable "street dealer." (I bet it would even be cheaper!) So far I haven't had to do that, and I sincerely hope I never do. My whole point is that some folks are just flat self destructive and are going to push the envelope and likely kill themselves. The rest of us have found a med that enhances the quality of our lives, and it's only the availability that is the problem. That has to change somewhere, somehow, for this war on drugs to ever evolve in any meaningful way.
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    I just watched a documentary about Fentanyl and people are dying because they are injecting it and they don't know the amount they are injecting, They even said themselves that their next hit could be their last and I can't help but say to myself "If you are going to take at least take it safely, In a safe dose/amount" To be completely honest I wouldn't mind trying it, but in a small/safe dosage.
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  7. #6
    One problem too, and I've read this a number of times, is that those who are really deep into addiction - not just self-medicating like most of this forum is - don't consider a strong batch of fent-laced stuff that kills a few people a "bad batch." They consider that a really good batch. They seek those out, when they hear that there is someone selling stuff people are dying on, because they are so deep into it that their tolerance is at the point where they are basically only holding off WDs and don't often get the highs, or get weaker highs. Shows how powerful the pull is that they're quite willing to play Russian Roulette with it - and also why traditional 12-step programs and the usual rehab procedure is statistically worthless with them.

    I think what is going to happen on the deaths is that they'll continue to climb with periods of small spikes here and there. But eventually it will drop off pretty sharply, I'd give it a couple years maybe. As the batches get more potent, odds of dying will go up each time. People with serious opioid addictions basically will either manage to stay off it (few) or they'll die. Not nearly as many are just getting started on it, that will mostly be teenagers and the most high-risk from here on out. Hard to guess but I think after the crash we'll go down to about a third or so of the deaths we're seeing now.

    Anyways, the ones who sell this stuff tend not to differentiate between those folks and us. You have to be so careful now to really have a source you can trust, and the good ones are going out more quickly now for a variety of reasons. Some dealers seem to be adding fent to damn near anything thinking it will make it more popular. It isn't a vendor I can discuss out here, but I think I'm ok to mention that awhile back I even got taken on an order of tram from overseas and got something that could possibly be a fent mix.
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    I lay off street stuff. I am a chronic paint patient. The fentanyl patch is very helpful to me. I still suffer but it helps and more than the other pain meds I've been on which are almost all.

    I hope this mess of polluted street drugs does not ruin a legitimate and properly used drug for people like me. The "gel" versions of the patch are almost gone and personally I prefer the smaller ones that stick well honestly.

    I admit I abused it a few times and nodded off. It's dangerous especially injected and with folks that jump in to waters they are not prepared to swim in.

    Agreed- the border is not the issue and I can assure u illegal fent is coming over in other ways such as via shipping containers and across legal points of our border.

    If fent goes away- they will find something else to pollute your street drugs. I am sure it's already happening but I don't research that as much as I do health research for my own issues, politics, the weather, and an occasional synonym for a current work or prose/poetry.

    I wish they would find a better class of drugs and wish there was a better delivery system of Ketamine/eskatamine for those that would benefit from it.

    Peace and good travels.

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    LOL- I took a look at my post. I never knew until now I am a "paint" patient. I do detest painting walls and so forth but have not reached out for professional help to overcome this hurdle.

    I would trade being a pain patient for paint unless I must inhale that nasty stuff. Migraines are bad enuff.

    My brain is sometimes too fast for my fingers and sometimes I just get in a bad way with typing . SORRY!!!

  10. Quote Originally Posted by awwwurz View Post
    LOL- I took a look at my post. I never knew until now I am a "paint" patient. I do detest painting walls and so forth but have not reached out for professional help to overcome this hurdle.

    I would trade being a pain patient for paint unless I must inhale that nasty stuff. Migraines are bad enuff.

    My brain is sometimes too fast for my fingers and sometimes I just get in a bad way with typing . SORRY!!!
    If you don't like inhaling paint, just inject it. lol

  11. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by jaders View Post
    Fentanyl is cheap
    that is exactly the bewildering part to me. Not that it is vividly dangerous as a result of how it is being used. It appears from the layman's perspective that replacing oxycod.. with fent is equivalent to replacing gold with platinum. literally every price tag i have ever seen puts fent.. much higher than anything else on the menu, that is when they can even stock it. admittedly i'm not a follower of either but isn't that you guy's observation? I haven't seen any sources with "fire sale" prices on boat loads of fent... so how does this make sense.
    not argumentative, i just don't get the supply demand factor. clearly it is happening i just don't see how that is profitable.
    any plausible explanation would be appreciated. if it is so readily available and cheap to produce why aren't sources making it a priority to sell it directly, without the dangerous mixtures?

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    Quote Originally Posted by awwwurz View Post
    LOL- I took a look at my post. I never knew until now I am a "paint" patient. I do detest painting walls and so forth but have not reached out for professional help to overcome this hurdle.

    I would trade being a pain patient for paint unless I must inhale that nasty stuff. Migraines are bad enuff.

    My brain is sometimes too fast for my fingers and sometimes I just get in a bad way with typing . SORRY!!!
    Don't try to "brush" this off
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildings View Post
    that is exactly the bewildering part to me. Not that it is vividly dangerous as a result of how it is being used. It appears from the layman's perspective that replacing oxycod.. with fent is equivalent to replacing gold with platinum. literally every price tag i have ever seen puts fent.. much higher than anything else on the menu, that is when they can even stock it. admittedly i'm not a follower of either but isn't that you guy's observation? I haven't seen any sources with "fire sale" prices on boat loads of fent... so how does this make sense.
    not argumentative, i just don't get the supply demand factor. clearly it is happening i just don't see how that is profitable.
    any plausible explanation would be appreciated. if it is so readily available and cheap to produce why aren't sources making it a priority to sell it directly, without the dangerous mixtures?
    Saw this the other day - fentanyl2_37790193_ver1.0_640_360.jpg

    It's a pretty difficult substance to work with, from what I gather. I really don't know too much, except that the ingredients are cheap and easily made in chinese pharm factories. It's said to be 100 times more potent than morphine. Since it is so powerful it usually makes its way in thru other pills as an additive. Would YOU be comfortable messing with the drug directly (in raw form?) I hear dogs have died sniffing out packages that contain it. Anyway, just some more thoughts about this subject...
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    @jaders, good visual representation of what we have been talking about in a few threads.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildings View Post
    Oh yes, i get the implications as mentioned above no doubt. i get that the chemistry allows it to be duplicated "off books" which i'm guessing it's not reliant on an opium poppy base. the part i'm not getting is why pray tell is not the market flooded with the stuff at more bang for the buck prices? not advocating anything only bewildered why the supply demand pricing/availability isn't reflected. from your excellent images, the substance requires such a miniscule space shipping seems like a giveaway. additionally if (that's a big is since i don't know) it's not an opium based product that would make it more difficult to detect thru the standard procedures.
    i know of about 2 sites with patches at oracle of omaha prices. i don't do dark net so clue clue on that.
    this is probably rhetorical but it's a real puzzle to me.
    Thank you for replying.
    edit: went ahead and did a quick search "Fentanyl is a synthetic opioid, which means it is manmade in laboratories. It does not rely on the opium poppy for production like opiates such"
    which leads to the obvious: why aren't people producing this like meth (all over)? then i have not walked this through the process, lab equipment required and ingredients.
    Supposedly it's being produced in China and then sent to south of the border. Or directly from China. I think you are asking why is it SO expensive, when it's so cheaply made? I think the "legit" patches are hugely expensive because they're so tightly controlled. I'm not sure about the other issue, except again, it's probably so difficult to "measure" and sell that way without so much danger? I don't really know, altho supposedly China's gov. is trying to crack down on the production... Also, maybe it's just the whole concept of getting whatever price the market will bear?

    Do you remember when heroin was very expensive, and then the cheap "black tar" substance showed. I've never bought heroin, but I hear it's much cheaper than it used to be.

    Give it time - I think what you're asking about may "evolve" and we WILL be able to find fentanyl cheaply and easily. Boy, the deaths are REALLY going to skyrocket when that happens...
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    I think that unlike "cooking" up some meth, producing a pharmaceutical grade of fetanyl would require a real background in organic/pharmaceutical chemistry and compounding knowledge and also some sophisticated equipment, and not just reading a a how to book picked up off the dark web. That is if you care about not killing your customer base, also, I think the people who are producing this are not casual in any way, but have made large investments in people and equipment. There is also the fact at a certain level if you become a threat to a syndicate's money, without being part of I am sure some kind of high level gentleman's agreement of who's controls what, you won't be around very long. I think this is some pretty high stakes stuff. I agree with @jaders, in that people who are doing this want to maximize profit and why cut prices if there is good reason to, so as much as the market can bear.

    Another link:
    https://apnews.com/d2296529ea94472d9f0d010f7bb99a2d

    If anyone comes across these, steer clear, they where found to contain anywhere from 30mcg to 1990mcg of fentanyl, a real crazy range, with near certain death at the upper ranges for opioid non-tolerant people and maybe tolerant people as well. Be careful out there.
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    Now, THIS is bizarre...

    https://apnews.com/2a40fb45332e48deb89ada69e71ed6a7

    At least we can count on pharma manufacturers to have our best interests at heart.
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    Fentanyl is also used during anesthesia along with diluadid. There's a shortage for them, according to some news stories, especially in veterinary medicine, as I guess Puerto Rico makes a lot of these drugs as well, and we all know how well things are recovering there (NOT.)

    I'll never forget being "put to sleep" for a minor laproscopic surgery, (this is almost thirty years ago) and the warm idyllic feeling that flooded me just before going out. I asked, as I drifted off, and was told it was fentanyl.

    In my opinion ONLY, every opiate gives the same basic feeling - at least that's how I experience it. They all fill the same receptors whether it's strong or slight. I suppose some vary a slight bit, but generally I find an opiate is an opiate. I want to take the least amount to get the job done, because the tolerance issue is always there. I can see why this particular drug will be "demanded" tho, and I think it will become as popular and readily available as heroin, if not more so as it won't involve having to "grow" anything. If they want to avoid this nightmare, they're going to have to allow folks better access to lower level pain meds - that's all there is to it. I can remember when they were reporting that heroin deaths were at an all-time LOW. I don't know what happened...
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    @jaders...I agree with you that easier and more reliable access to lower level pain meds would help at least some of the illegal users, although I'm not sure that it would help that many who are already deep into the street level drugs. I think for those people the answer is probably just safe injection sites. I'm talking about people who've built up such a high tolerance that a pain prescription probably won't do it.

    Lets face it, the heroin/cocaine/fentanyl situation is a problem because the geniuses who decide what's right for us made laws based on their own perception of morality. They scared and harassed doctors, they're suing pharma companies, and they've made laws that put such a burden on people struggling with pain that their pain is actually amplified.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaders View Post
    Now, THIS is bizarre...

    https://apnews.com/2a40fb45332e48deb89ada69e71ed6a7

    At least we can count on pharma manufacturers to have our best interests at heart.
    Having worked for several doctors I can tell you this business practice (using sexy women, Giving away free pills, giving financial incentives, giving gifts, dinners etc.) is the norm. Yes giving a doctor a lap dance and making a rap video is going a bit too far, but everything else does happen in a normal day. When it comes to sales, you have to do whatever gets you in the door. Most male doctors will listen to a pretty female sales rep - and sign up just based on her smile and interest. The same goes for women. Give them a young handsome hunky man with a smile and they will bite too. I am sure they will get the book thrown at them, but the sales people are just doing whatever it takes to get the sales up. There is little consideration for the end of the line buyer. So, your right - you can't count on them to have our best interests at heart. No matter how "helpful" and "quality of life saving" lingo they use. It all comes down to $$$.
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  21. Fent*nyl flood.

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