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Thread: Lawmaker trying to focus opioid fight on international mail

  1. #1

    Default Lawmaker trying to focus opioid fight on international mail

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/opioid-...s-rob-portman/

    The push for the info on all packages is the STOP Act HR 1057 that is in the works, but the postal service is actually fighting that themselves, as the requirements would be very impractical to impossible for some countries to meet, and the costs on our end would be enormous - http://www.cleveland.com/nation/inde...ck_agains.html Once again it was Portman making the fuss.

    I won't rant much again here except to say that given how few fent packages they are actually catching, if they invest huge money into mail scanning above what they are doing with the Interdict Act, they will, I suspect, have to target other stuff in order to produce the kind of numbers and statistics to justify the cost. Even if they stick to confiscation rather than the prosecution I fear coming for small-timers, it will put a damper on IOPs if the catch rate gets high enough.

    Good idea to follow the progress on all this, at least.

    ETA: Here is Portman's full report- https://www.portman.senate.gov/publi...6-181EE6716F37

    ETA again: Just want to add I know that the fent is a problem, particularly as it endangers handlers and first responders. I'm not arguing in favor of that stuff, more concerned with the impact what they are doing will have on those of us doing no harm, simply self-medicating and trying to live our lives. Also, if they manage to put a big damper on IOPs, it will just drive prices up and drive the dealers back stateside, and those higher prices will tempt more hardcore and organized groups into the sales - in other words, create more real crime back here. There is no easy solution to get people who are to the point of taking mail order fent clean, but if they'd open their minds to proven harm-reduction strategies, then they could likely about eliminate the fent demand and seriously lower the number of deaths.
    Last edited by Anne Onomis; 3 Weeks Ago at 10:39 AM.

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    Lawmaker trying to focus opioid fight on international mail
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    He's just another senator from OH that is doing a dance to get his name out there - fighting the good fight for the people - you know - wasting time and money trying to look like he's doing something.
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  4. It is disgusting that this person wants to put all of our resources into synthetic opioids. What about natural opioids are the excluded? What about the drug dealer on a corner who is selling herion which most users get it from. I mean people who are addicted to to such substances are primarily trying to obtain the drug as quickly as possible. I cannot imagine that they would have the patience to use the Internet. But his Subcommittee knows better LOL.

    Well one way around this is that IOPs might “hide” the products. I cannot say how because I would blow my membership. But there are IOPS that currently do that.
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    @Anne Onomis...I have to think that no one's really going to DO anything on a federal level regarding the overdose situation. There's going to be lots of congressmen talking big because they have constituients who are expecting them to do something. But I find it hard to believe that there's any actual interest in this coming from the White House. States are actually making things more difficult that Feds.

    The issue's been bounced from Jared Kushner, to Chris Christie, to Kelly Anne Conway! to now THIS 24 year old kid who's going to have to find a new job after lying on his resume. I'm mean seriously, if they were interested in this, I'd think they'd at least check the guy's references. He only had one job before joining the campaign so that wouldn't have been too hard to check...

    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...b0022830094616

    Then, the money allocated for all of it I believe was in the millions, not billions - peanuts. Although there's lots of talk, I just don't see anything much happening without funding and that's just not happening at the federal level. And after declaring it a crisis, Trump came up with basically "just say no" and this for a plan:

    “We are going to overcome addiction in America,” the president said.

    The designation of a public health crisis, formally made by Eric D. Hargan, the acting health secretary, would allow for some grant money to be used to combat opioid abuse, permit the hiring of specialists to tackle the crisis, and expand the use of telemedicine services to treat people in rural areas ravaged by opioid use, where doctors are often in short supply.

    Mr. Trump said his plan would include a requirement that federally employed prescribers be trained in safe practices for opioid prescriptions, and a new federal initiative to develop nonaddictive painkillers, as well as intensified efforts to block shipments of fentanyl, a cheap and extremely potent synthetic opioid manufactured in China, into the United States.

  6. #5
    Pfft.

    Use, abuse, prescription. Pot-kettle-black.

    Well, violating anyone's privacy is WRONG, full stop. Next they'll want to know what you've written.and to whom. Opening this Pandora's box let's all the demons out.

    Disgusting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenousbird View Post
    Pfft.

    Use, abuse, prescription. Pot-kettle-black.

    Well, violating anyone's privacy is WRONG, full stop. Next they'll want to know what you've written.and to whom. Opening this Pandora's box let's all the demons out.

    Disgusting.

    Big Pharma lining pockets in the US. I'm guessing this story got a lot of play time on main stream media (of which I watch very little).
    Reason - I know a person that travels a lot for business and likes to watch MSM in the hotels rooms early AM and PM. Talked to this person last night after a trip and was telling me (with an outraged tone) "Did you know you can order OPIOIDS from OVERSEAS and they will mail them RIGHT TO YOUR HOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!".

    *sigh*
    "All cruelty springs from weakness." --Seneca (4 BC - AD 65)

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by djrick View Post
    Big Pharma lining pockets in the US. I'm guessing this story got a lot of play time on main stream media (of which I watch very little).
    Reason - I know a person that travels a lot for business and likes to watch MSM in the hotels rooms early AM and PM. Talked to this person last night after a trip and was telling me (with an outraged tone) "Did you know you can order OPIOIDS from OVERSEAS and they will mail them RIGHT TO YOUR HOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!".

    *sigh*
    Heh, the media is probably going to send us some new members by doing that.
    @Bawston - Yep, could just be big talk, and on the subcommittee report it was clear the USPS was pushing back hard on things they were trying and wanting. Not to harp on my usual fear too much, but sure hope they don't conclude that busting a bunch of buyers and playing it up (small amounts of prescription meds being branded dangerous synthetic opioids possibly laced with fent), along with the stats on incoming packages resulting from scaring the hell out of everyone buying, is a great way to "do something" without spending too much. Put it this way, if I were lacking in empathy and wanting to appeal to a conservative base of voters, it is exactly what I would do. Many would LOVE it, no doubt at all.
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  9. #8
    Meanwhile, back home, Monsanto is altering our food and killing us ever so softly, all with the blessings of our well-funded (bribed), esteemed solons. All of whom voted for the Monsanto Protection Act. I mean, a soft kill is better than a hard one, right? No one is after Monsanto's scalp?

    Meanwhile, our older folks depending on SS are getting killed because the COLA's are near zero. Why, you ask? Because the same government that pays their SS is understating inflation through the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the modern day equivalent of Dr. Goebbels Propaganda Ministerium. The GOP just loves to cut costs by leaving older people out in the cold. You have to worry when you see Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell smiling at the conclusion of a congressional session. You know you're in for one hell of a reaming.

    Fear not, Good Citizens, your government is going to protect the living shit out of you, whether you like it or not, at any cost to the taxpayer. They will remove those 0.0000001% of packages that contain fent and kick the be-jeezus out of all of you in the process.

    I apologize for the rant, I just can't deal with it anymore.
    The USA government......protecting its citizens from accessible, affordable med's since 1914

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bawston View Post
    @Anne Onomis...I have to think that no one's really going to DO anything on a federal level regarding the overdose situation. There's going to be lots of congressmen talking big because they have constituients who are expecting them to do something. But I find it hard to believe that there's any actual interest in this coming from the White House. States are actually making things more difficult that Feds.

    The issue's been bounced from Jared Kushner, to Chris Christie, to Kelly Anne Conway! to now THIS 24 year old kid who's going to have to find a new job after lying on his resume. I'm mean seriously, if they were interested in this, I'd think they'd at least check the guy's references. He only had one job before joining the campaign so that wouldn't have been too hard to check...

    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...b0022830094616

    Then, the money allocated for all of it I believe was in the millions, not billions - peanuts. Although there's lots of talk, I just don't see anything much happening without funding and that's just not happening at the federal level. And after declaring it a crisis, Trump came up with basically "just say no" and this for a plan:

    “We are going to overcome addiction in America,” the president said.

    The designation of a public health crisis, formally made by Eric D. Hargan, the acting health secretary, would allow for some grant money to be used to combat opioid abuse, permit the hiring of specialists to tackle the crisis, and expand the use of telemedicine services to treat people in rural areas ravaged by opioid use, where doctors are often in short supply.

    Mr. Trump said his plan would include a requirement that federally employed prescribers be trained in safe practices for opioid prescriptions, and a new federal initiative to develop nonaddictive painkillers, as well as intensified efforts to block shipments of fentanyl, a cheap and extremely potent synthetic opioid manufactured in China, into the United States.
    @Bawston, as hopeless as this seems right now, wouldn't it be awfully nice if some researchers were actually able to develop "nonaddictive painkillers" that worked? And that's as far as I can bring myself to say anything else nice about what Our Government is doing about the problem (not even of addiction, but of overdose deaths, if I'm being perfectly fair here.)

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    @calgal99...it sure would be nice for researchers to come up with something that actually worked although I'm not sure that nonaddictive is the right word. I would say something that's unlikely to be abused because any medication used long term will probably have addictive properties. It's like any medication that someone relies on, you can't just stop. Thing is though almost anything can be abused and people will find a way but I know what you mean and at my age I'm not sure that I'll be seeing anything like that.

    They say that if aspirin were to come on the market now that it probably wouldn't get approval because "of its side effects". Of course now we're hearing about the dangers of ibuprophen and Tylenol. I actually just read an article by a doctor at a very reputable (for the life of me I can't remember which one though) hospital that said that for older patients, such as myself, that opioids were the safest and most effective pain relievers available compared to say Ibuprophen due to stomach bleeds and Tylenol due to liver problems.

    I'm of the belief that a doctor knows me and my history better than a politician.
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    Without judgement, truly I mean that, I don't go near opiates because I got very addicted to them. This happened under a doctor's care. I don't even know if I was addicted because I was really taking them to not feel like crud because I hadn't taken them. I had several surgeries, one almost right after the other following a c-section that had gone awry, had opened up because they missed a bleeder and the staples eventually burst like a dam with me gushing blood everywhere. By that time, it was too late to sew me up/staple me together again so I ended up with 8 weeks of packing a massive incision after a 14 day hospital stay. Things did not heal nicely and I also needed a hernia repair and some additional surgery. Throughout the whole surgical process, which took probably 9 months total- I had a surgeon prescribing me norcos and percosets like candy and assuring me that I wouldn't get addicted, yada yada yada. I did become tolerant and the doctor just prescribed more and higher dosages. Looking back, I would have sought alternatives or made sure I got a break between healing from one surgery and going to the next so that didn't happen. When the doc cut me off cold turkey I thought I was going to die and sought alternative sources- which meant getting some from friends and then one extra helpful friend who taught me all about how to get them online!

    Anyhow, I eventually weaned myself off when they stopped being readily available domestically(with the help of kratom) - and no, I am not still using Kratom. LOL. I then had to wean myself off of that but it wasn't nearly so bad as getting off the pharmaceuticals.

    I so feel for people who say "If you'd asked me 5 years ago if I'd ever be a heroin user, I would have told you you were crazy" because, trust me, I know when you are in the throes of withdrawal, you'll do just about anything to feel better. I'm just glad I was/am too clueless to buy drugs off the street, lol.

    I think it is horrible that people are dying in droves from overdosing. It would be nice to see the government put some actual backing behind harm reduction as opposed to crazy ass policy that denigrates our privacy further and really does very little to help those who are actually suffering.

    As always, just my .02.

    DS

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    @Doubleshot...I think it's good to hear from people who've had experiences different from our own, especially someone who's not coming off as judgmental. It sounds as if you had a horrible experience and I'm glad that you made it through that as well as recovery. I think the key is what you said - helping people rather than assuming everyone's a criminal.

    In a related thread someone brought up how great it would be if we were all treated as individuals. Everyone's pain experience is different, everyone's story is unique, and everyone could benefit from an individualized treatment plan.
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    Good input everyone.

    The thing is, here south of the border, the cartel is a step ahead of the Chinese in regards to Fent production (they already control the meth trade here which is a larger problem than opiates atm) It will never end. So they stop international packages, and???

    It means more creative ways for suppliers to send/obtain. Agreed that Fent is a bit overkill and totally unnecessary for the average pain patient, but it was only a matter of time til they started lacing the heroin with it. In 6mos it will be a totally new chemical or analogue....hopefully not this dangerous but i doubt it.

    J

  16. #15
    Hmmm the links wouldn't work for me...but to state the obvious - so apologies if I'm going off topic. But if doctors would follow, treat and RX meds to people with TRUE chronic pain there would be a lot less people trying to find them online. Of course there are people that do not have CP and just are looking for meds to abuse. But sadly those people have made it difficult, and pretty much impossible for people like me with true CP to find a doctor who will rx meds so I can function without crying.

    But the docs are now afraid of losing their license if they rx too much. Can't blame them for being scared - they don't want to lose their license.

    It is a sad state of affairs. I try not to think too far into the future because we all have a breaking point, and I honestly don't know what to do when I get there
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    They could make treatment of addiction easier to get and meds that are cheaper. Stopping the flow from one place will just make them think of a different way to get it here. Make treatment easy to obtain, that's how you fight addiction.Idiots.
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    Don’t worry folks, we’ll get a ‘just say no’ campaign and all the money willl be spent on national advertising - so they look like they’re doing something - and a stupid border wall that everything will just just go around. Meanwhile, nobody will get any actual help as @Brianna9 says, and Jeff Sessions the private prison system will get a much needed infusion of poor people. Who knows! Maybe Arpaio will be on the next committee!
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    “Good people don't smoke pot” - Jeff Sessions rational for enforcing federal marijuana laws intended to put poor people into the private prison system he is a big investor in.

  19. #18
    Seriously, I'd laugh at this post except it's so close to what will probably happen (Sessions and the horrifying private prison system) that I actually want to cry.
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  20. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by MRNUTTY View Post
    and Jeff Sessions the private prison system will get a much needed infusion of poor people.
    Yep, his new J-CODE thing, though being sold as targeting darknet vendors of fent and such, pings on all my paranoia buttons about them really wanting to pluck the low-hanging fruit - the buyers - https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.069a5143c3e7

    After all, with the markets, it is nothing but a hydra - cut off one head, two more pop up. You'll never shut down that side of it so long as the demand is there. There is a bottomless pool of desperately poor people willing to risk it to earn a few bucks. If they are just wanting to look like they are "doing something" then it might work to net them a few, like they've already been doing here and there. Hopefully that is all there is to it. But I worry there is a lot more to this, and I suspect it will involve really stretching who they brand as somebody intending to distribute.
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  21. Quote Originally Posted by Doubleshot View Post
    Without judgement, truly I mean that, I don't go near opiates because I got very addicted to them. This happened under a doctor's care. I don't even know if I was addicted because I was really taking them to not feel like crud because I hadn't taken them. I had several surgeries, one almost right after the other following a c-section that had gone awry, had opened up because they missed a bleeder and the staples eventually burst like a dam with me gushing blood everywhere. By that time, it was too late to sew me up/staple me together again so I ended up with 8 weeks of packing a massive incision after a 14 day hospital stay. Things did not heal nicely and I also needed a hernia repair and some additional surgery. Throughout the whole surgical process, which took probably 9 months total- I had a surgeon prescribing me norcos and percosets like candy and assuring me that I wouldn't get addicted, yada yada yada. I did become tolerant and the doctor just prescribed more and higher dosages. Looking back, I would have sought alternatives or made sure I got a break between healing from one surgery and going to the next so that didn't happen. When the doc cut me off cold turkey I thought I was going to die and sought alternative sources- which meant getting some from friends and then one extra helpful friend who taught me all about how to get them online!

    Anyhow, I eventually weaned myself off when they stopped being readily available domestically(with the help of kratom) - and no, I am not still using Kratom. LOL. I then had to wean myself off of that but it wasn't nearly so bad as getting off the pharmaceuticals.

    I so feel for people who say "If you'd asked me 5 years ago if I'd ever be a heroin user, I would have told you you were crazy" because, trust me, I know when you are in the throes of withdrawal, you'll do just about anything to feel better. I'm just glad I was/am too clueless to buy drugs off the street, lol.

    I think it is horrible that people are dying in droves from overdosing. It would be nice to see the government put some actual backing behind harm reduction as opposed to crazy ass policy that denigrates our privacy further and really does very little to help those who are actually suffering.

    As always, just my .02.

    DS
    All of this was planned and executed perfectly almost 100 years ago.

    In 1913, the central bank was created and federal income tax was enacted, even though the 16th amendment to the constitution was never passed, think about that, But then, what is a constitution, just a "goddam piece of paper" as our beloved ex-president GWB once said (more on the Bush clan later). At the same time, drug use was criminalized, via the 1906 food and drug legislation and the Harrison Narcotic Act of 1914. All this happened in a short span of time, coincidence?

    These 3 actions were a direct strike at our liberties, by the rich and powerful money-makers. They were tired of representative democracy. They wanted something "better" - for them, anyway.

    Central banks enable large and powerful governments to expand through deficit spending and borrowing. They also transfer wealth through from the poor and middle class to the rich via the mechanism of inflation, which is brought about by deficit spending and money printing. Wealth is never lost - the inflation that robs your savings and starves older people on Social Security goes straight into the pockets of the wealthy.

    Drug criminalization create a permanent underclass of citizens, that can be vilified, objectified, and exploited by the state. They become the permanent scapegoats for the State. They can be blamed for every misery and failure that the State visits on their citizen-slaves.

    Federal income tax is yet another mechanism by which the State transfers wealth from the poorer people to the rich. The rich don't pay these taxes. They can hide their income, build elaborate tax shelters, and lobby for special tax treatment. The working poor have no such option. Worse, the taxes they pay end up funding the Endless War Machine, which of course is an extension of the corporations that reap lucrative contracts and build the weapons. So we can kill people. It's good for business.

    Strangely enough, most people are completely unaware of this. They know more about the NFL than they do about what is happening to them, their families, their lives. They vote for one of the two major parties and hope that it can make a difference. It doesn't.

    It can only end one way. If you've studied history, you know what that is. It won't be pretty.

    EDIT, almost forgot, that same beloved president I mentioned has been one of the major beneficiaries of this system. Bush Co. made boatloads of money before and during WWII funding BOTH SIDES. I guess I can see why he would resent that pesky US constitution. It just gets in the way of their plans. But, that's okay. They have the Patriot Act (best name ever for a totalitarian act), the NDAA, and 100 executive orders that are designed to circumvent that "goddam piece of paper".

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9HFjErMMlA
    Last edited by GreenThumb; 1 Week Ago at 08:21 AM.
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    The USA government......protecting its citizens from accessible, affordable med's since 1914

  22. Lawmaker trying to focus opioid fight on international mail

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