• Please take a moment to review some of the most important new forum features here and here

Tolerance to Benzos

Recommended Pharmacies on Pharmacy Reviewer

enigma

Distinguished member
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Posts
715
So I have been a member of this forum for quite a few years, sometimes leaving for a while then coming back again. I only recently really started taking benzos again, always to help me sleep, but within a very short period my tolerance has gone sky high meaning they become pretty useless. I know of people on small doses of benzos for years and they are convinced they still work. I was even considering taking Phenobarbital for a couple of weeks (dangerous I know) just to try to lower my resistance and start again. Anyone have any tricks or is there any point in swapping from one benzo to another? Thanks all!!
 

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
@enigma Yes, I have similar issues with benzo's and sleep. Even the type designed for sleep 'Temazepam' fairs a little better but eventually you will hit that tolerance threshold and they just stop working. I have similar issues with Z class, that work for a night (two if I'm lucky) then become completely useless (even faster tolerance buildup than benzo"s).

I usually try to alternate between Z class, benzo's and taking nothing. Soma helps with my pain which in turn helps with my sleep but, I only take them twice a week or in emergencies. I did go the natural route too, the only thing that actually helped was something called 5-HTP which did help me sleep but, I did have horrific nightmares on them although I dont know how common that is.

I hope you find something that works, its not a pleasant place to be.
 
Last edited:

enigma

Distinguished member
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Posts
715
Thanks @Chancer, when you alternate between Z class meds and benzos, how long do you stay on each one before switching?

My doctor actually prescribed Temazepam for me before and it did nothing 🙈. I usually fare better with Zopiclone for some reason. Found Lorazepam fab but that honeymoon ended very quickly, now I barely register an extremely high dose
 

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
@enigma No more than two days on either and I try to have a break between switching from one to the other. My biggest issue is the Soma which I take twice a week (Normally at the weekends so I can keep track easier). They are supposedly similar to benzos but I can't seem to get a straight forward answer on how closely related they are which does worry me.

Routine is the biggest challenge, waking up then going to bed at the same time every day etc. Then your body adjusts to the routine, some people add Melatonin (the sleep chemical) to the mix but I found them unhelpful. Thats what Z class was supposed to do, take a 14 or 28 day course to get your system into a routine. Unfortunately most people find they stop working too quickly, 3 days at a push for me with z class. Its strange because I don't seem to build the same kind of tolerance to my pain meds, so I know its not 'my' system thats the issue.

I find using Zopiclone and Zolpidem helpful (small doses of each) because I have trouble both falling and staying asleep. If Zopiclone worked better for you then your 'issue' is staying asleep. Zolpidem have a shorter window and are slightly stronger in putting you to sleep. Zopiclone 3.5 or 7.5mg whereas Zolpiden is slightly 'higher' at 5 or 10mg.

When I was in the hospital I had 20mg of Temazepam and 15mg of Zopiclone and that worked wonders, was literally the only thing that did work consistently although thats unsustainable long term.
 

tycho

Honorable member
Joined
Nov 8, 2011
Posts
348
@enigma No more than two days on either and I try to have a break between switching from one to the other. My biggest issue is the Soma which I take twice a week (Normally at the weekends so I can keep track easier). They are supposedly similar to benzos but I can't seem to get a straight forward answer on how closely related they are which does worry me.

Routine is the biggest challenge, waking up then going to bed at the same time every day etc. Then your body adjusts to the routine, some people add Melatonin (the sleep chemical) to the mix but I found them unhelpful. Thats what Z class was supposed to do, take a 14 or 28 day course to get your system into a routine. Unfortunately most people find they stop working too quickly, 3 days at a push for me with z class. Its strange because I don't seem to build the same kind of tolerance to my pain meds, so I know its not 'my' system thats the issue.

I find using Zopiclone and Zolpidem helpful (small doses of each) because I have trouble both falling and staying asleep. If Zopiclone worked better for you then your 'issue' is staying asleep. Zolpidem have a shorter window and are slightly stronger in putting you to sleep. Zopiclone 3.5 or 7.5mg whereas Zolpiden is slightly 'higher' at 5 or 10mg.

When I was in the hospital I had 20mg of Temazepam and 15mg of Zopiclone and that worked wonders, was literally the only thing that did work consistently although thats unsustainable long term.

20mg of Temazepam and 15mg of Zopiclone At the same time? Interesting. I have both (Eszopiclone, actually) but given my low-level usage might be hesitant to try them at the same time.

For sleep I take a double-dose of Eszopiclone, or Zolpidem, or Zaleplon. That is the order of decreasing effectiveness for me. Not sure Zaleplon even works. Zolpidem helps me get to sleep but I wake up in the wee hours. Eszopiclone is the best for me. I separate taking each by 3-4 days to minimize tolerance and/or dependence, which I have never noticed to date.
 

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
@tycho Yes, I was in a bad accident and had fractured my spine in two places, broke a few ribs and pierced a lung. I was an in patient for 6 months then 6 month in a brace.

I was prescribed Oxy in the hospital and they always affect my sleep (which I was unaware of at the time on top of the pain). Thats why I eventually switched from Oxy SR to Morphine SR instead to help when I was an out patient.

I do wonder if the high doses messed up my sleeping but I literally wouldn't sleep without them until completely exhausted then it was a few hours here and there.
 

sleeper

Lapsed Senior Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Posts
196
All of the benzos are pretty rough for me (and most people). They are not necessarily "making" you sleep, because they are not actually tranquilizers. And getting dependent is horrid. I do get good sleep with ambien, but I don't really feel all too great the next day. As I was younger, I never had any side effect with benzos, so they seemed a good solution. Now I do get some dizziness and neausea. So i really have to cut it off after only a few days. They are better for anxiety.

Phenobarbital can be helpful, but has a ridiculously long 96 hour half-life! So I avoid any repeat doses. If soma is effective for you, it can help bridge the gap. I think you will find that you have GOT to take some longer breaks from benzos. Even at low doses, it was difficult for me. Very deceptive.

Melatonin does work and helps sometimes.

Over time, I realized that I do have to bite the bullet and go without sleep if necessary for my life to work. I survived. You get used to it.
 

cajunbulldog

Eminent member
Joined
Apr 25, 2011
Posts
1,176
The government healthcare does not like benzos class drugs so I take a cocktail every night and hope for the best.I take 10mg melatonin,150mg elavil,300mg Seroquil,& 300mg trazadone. I still get poor sleep at least twice a week.Hope you can find what works for you.
 

enigma

Distinguished member
Joined
Mar 23, 2012
Posts
715
@Chancer and @sleeper, I am prescribed Melatonin as well at 9mg per night but they stopped working so taking a break from them. While I find Zopiclone better my problem has always been getting to sleep. Once I get to sleep I'm grand. I might try mixing Zopiclone and Zolpidem then and stop everything else and see how I go 😴
 

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
@enigma They don't need to be high doses when mixing the two. Especially if you are consistently going to bed at 9pm which is the best thing you can do. I would try the 3.5 and 5mg (half them if you need too).

Then if you have a particularly bad night you can take 7.5 and 10mg sporadically. I've found this works for me, I'm very cautious of 'tolerance' and its a system that's worked well with my pain meds. I've been on 30-50mg of SR Morphine for years and no tolerance/withdrawals when I drop from 50 to 30 (usually the 50 is only in the winter months or after a particularly 'active' day). I do have Oxy for breakthrough pain or when its completely unbearable (usually in the mornings), thats a nightmare when you can't get to the toilet first thing in the morning. My toilet is literally 10 steps from my bed (yes, I actually counted 🤣).
 

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
@cajunbulldog The UK hates benzo's, thats why I think they mixed both in the hospital when they realised that the 20mg of Temazepam wasn't working. They used to have 30mg temazepam in the UK but they are literally unheard of these days. They are called 'black bullets' and are used by a the special forces when they need to sleep for an 'op', they are the only people I've read that still have access to them in the UK.
 

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
As I was younger, I never had any side effect with benzos, so they seemed a good solution. Now I do get some dizziness and neausea.
Interestingly they don't recommend benzo's for the elderly, I always assumed it was related to respiratory issues. Perhaps its something else that shows in the data on how our systems 'break them down' as we get older?
 

dinger

Honorable member
Joined
Mar 26, 2015
Posts
444
@cajunbulldog The UK hates benzo's, thats why I think they mixed both in the hospital when they realised that the 20mg of Temazepam wasn't working. They used to have 30mg temazepam in the UK but they are literally unheard of these days. They are called 'black bullets' and are used by a the special forces when they need to sleep for an 'op', they are the only people I've read that still have access to them in the UK.
When temazepam came in gel-tex caps..They were so much better..but when they changed them to chalkies they went near as good...
I can clearly remind them being better!!lol As a hypnotic...I..like the story of " black bullets" never heard of that one...
Zoplidem(ambien) was handed out to US forces but not sure UK.... They used be a speed tablet called " black bombers"
But that was back in the 60 its proper name "Duraphet"..............
 
Last edited:

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
@dinger I remember the jellies, I preferred the yellow to the green ones but I never knew what/if the difference was. I agree about the 'chalkies' they just didn't have the same 'kick' as the jellies that worked in 10 minutes if you split them with your teeth. I could do with a couple now at 4am 😉

I might have confused the black bombers with black bullets, I think it was an Andy McNab or a Bob Shepherd book I read it in, so it would/could have been UK. The US are a little stricter on their SF writing books. McNab's was hush money for a botched op in Iraq that set a bad precedent imo. Bob Shepherds book The Circuit (Factual book) is brilliant though and definitely worth the read. He was actually supposed to take command of the originally botched McNab op but, he was too professional and experienced so pointed out all the issues and what team members he wanted based on various experiences (an SAS tradition), but they just replaced him with McNab who had little/no real experience in a command position.

Not really a fan of his books (McNab) you can always tell when it switches from the ghost writer to him, I remember reading a literal step by step guide on how to break into someone's home, he was bragging like it was a Blue Peter demonstration, I couldn't understand why he would be allowed to give that much irrelevant unnecessary info in a 'fictional book' I have no idea, I'm clearly not a fan . You've set me off on books lol, my passion in life. 😆

I do remember they used various Amphetamines in Vietnam but didn't know what they were called.

Nice to 'see' you again @dinger 😊
 

dinger

Honorable member
Joined
Mar 26, 2015
Posts
444
@Chancer I was nearly over in the gulf " iraq " if had joined up 6 months before hand..But i did recieve the JABS for
The gulf war but did not go over..It was over in 1 to two weeks if i remember correctly....
I would stick to " chris ryan" when it comes to SAS stuff...
 

Chancer

Exalted member
Joined
May 25, 2012
Posts
2,730
@dinger I much prefer Chris Ryan, he is definitely more likable which comes across in his books. If you havn't already then you should definitely read 'Bob Shepherds' books, he's in a class of his own and the best, most informative and honest books I've ever read from an 'SAS' writer. He doesn't sugar coat but he's got a nice calm likable persona. He also vowed to never write a book about his time in the SAS because he sees how counterproductive those books can be for our troops.

I remember them being concerned about biological weapons which was why they justified the jabs ? I remember it being over very quickly, its what probably contributed to the overconfidence with the 2nd Iraq War.

I had a quick search on the meds in the military, you sent me off on a mission lol. Found some interesting info on them currently using Modafinil. See attachments:
 

Attachments

sleeper

Lapsed Senior Member
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Posts
196
@enigma i do wish you the best with that and please report back.

in my case, i had some issues even with ambien in using it for too long. you simply develop a tolerance too quickly and then can't sleep at all. once i found some texts on my phone once which i swore i did not remember sending! there were eventually some stomach issues which i would have the following day. i have not tried the zopiclone and i would be interested to hear...
 
Top
AdBlock Detected

Ad blocking browser plugins interfere with some features of this forum. For the best site experience please disable your ad blocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock    No Thanks